Hi all,

I've been studying some of these questions for the Extra exam and I am having
a bit of difficulty. I think the biggest block is the fact that I'm never likely to need half the stuff I have to remember, and if I ever do, I'm going to look it up on the internet.

If I'm going to build an antenna, you bet your life I'm going to find one on the internet that someone has already designed, tested, and tweaked.

So for those who have recently studied and passed the extra, how do you get this stuff to stick in your mind long enough to pass the test?
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So for those who have recently studied and passed the extra, how do you get this stuff to stick in your mind long enough to pass the test?

I used HamTestOnline, studying 2 hours a day for 2 weeks. I barely
passed the test (back in 2007), but it was good enough. If you can
get a good grasp on the rest of the stuff, you don't have to worry
about the math and electronic theory...which weren't my high points,
either.

HamTestOnline does offer a money back guarantee, if you fail the exam.
But, in using them, I went from Technician to General in 14 days, and
from General to Amateur Extra 13 days later. To me, it was the best money
I ever spent in ham radio.

Daryl, WX4QZ

... Deja Tue: When you have a feeling yesterday was Monday.
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Daryl wrote:

So for those who have recently studied and passed the extra, how do you get this stuff to stick in your mind long enough to pass the test?

I used HamTestOnline, studying 2 hours a day for 2 weeks. I barely
passed the test (back in 2007), but it was good enough. If you can
get a good grasp on the rest of the stuff, you don't have to worry
about the math and electronic theory...which weren't my high points,
either.

HamTestOnline does offer a money back guarantee, if you fail the exam.
But, in using them, I went from Technician to General in 14 days, and
from General to Amateur Extra 13 days later. To me, it was the best money
I ever spent in ham radio.

I may invest if I can find the time to indulge myself in 2 weeks of relentless bombardment of facts, figures, and forumlas that I will never care about
again, probably :)

The only other thing is me balking at the cost of a decent radio setup.
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On 10 Aug 2020, Nigel Reed said the following...

I'm never likely to need half the stuff I have to remember, and if I

Then I'd argue you probably don't need extra. After a little over two years into radio, I've used something from every section of the test except
sat, and even that knowledge I've used in discussions with people.

Why are you interested in extra?

If I'm going to build an antenna, you bet your life I'm going to find
one on the internet that someone has already designed, tested, and tweaked.

I can tell you in no uncertain terms, every antenna you buy or built, *maybe* with the exception of a loop or metal vertical, is going to need some antenna knowledge to get the best performance out of it.

I have operated with plenty of people of all sorts, including a bunch with extra class, and about 80% of them have damn near no idea what they're doing with antennas, setup, and/or operating. I promise that if you learn what's in extra and put it into practice as you need it, you'll find value in it.

So for those who have recently studied and passed the extra, how do you get this stuff to stick in your mind long enough to pass the test?

Everyone is different. My son, Etienne, memorizes well and just used hamstudy.org to memorize the easy parts. Then he used The Fast Track to Your Extra... by Michael Burnette audio book for the harder parts.

I used hamstudy for the parts I mostly already knew. Then for the harder
parts, especially electronics, I would listen to the Fast Track book on 1.25x and follow along with the regular book.

Etienne passed with a couple wrong answers. I did worse. He was eleven at the time. :-/


- Andre, WI9AJR

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Re: Re: Trying to study for extra
By: Andre Robitaille to Nigel Reed on Thu Aug 13 2020 07:30:16

Then I'd argue you probably don't need extra. After a little over two years into radio, I've used something from every section of the test except
sat, and even that knowledge I've used in discussions with people.

THe main reason for it is trying not to remember which frequencies I can use as tech and which I can't. It also means that if I'm eventually going to put down stupid amounts of money for an antenna and radio setup, I'll be able to get one that covers all the frequencies, not wasting any, and not having to upgrade later.

I have operated with plenty of people of all sorts, including a bunch with extra class, and about 80% of them have damn near no idea what they're doing with antennas, setup, and/or operating. I promise that if you learn what's in extra and put it into practice as you need it, you'll find value in it.

I guess it's not a matter of not needing it, but not having to needing to remember it when we have plenty of instant online resources. It'd probably be quicker for me to look up some forumla calculator on Google than to perform it myself.

I really don't think I'm ever going to need stuff like "What is a typical range for tropospheric propagation of microwave signals?"

I used hamstudy for the parts I mostly already knew. Then for the harder parts, especially electronics, I would listen to the Fast Track book on 1.25x and follow along with the regular book.

I used hamstudy.org to get me through my General. I really have no idea how I passed my Technician. I think it was more luck than skill.
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On 13 Aug 2020, Nigel Reed said the following...

THe main reason for it is trying not to remember which frequencies I can use as tech and which I can't. It also means that if I'm eventually

That's one of the two main reasons I did it. When contesting, I was finding people just below the general limits. The second reason is that I was pretty sure I could get my son's picture in QST magazine if I did it right.

going to put down stupid amounts of money for an antenna and radio
setup, I'll be able to get one that covers all the frequencies, not wasting any, and not having to upgrade later.

I'm not really following this line of thinking.

I guess it's not a matter of not needing it, but not having to needing to remember it when we have plenty of instant online resources. It'd
probably be quicker for me to look up some forumla calculator on Google than to perform it myself.

For forumlas, definitely. But for everything else, whether on the electonics bench or out working on antennas or operating, I don't want to keep heading
to the internet over and over. And besides, I've never found something for radio on the internet that worked perfectly without tweaking.

I really don't think I'm ever going to need stuff like "What is a
typical range for tropospheric propagation of microwave signals?"

Guess you're not interested in mesh networking yet. :)


- Andre

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Re: Re: Trying to study for extra
By: Andre Robitaille to Nigel Reed on Thu Aug 13 2020 22:13:34

I'm not really following this line of thinking.

Not at all.
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On 14 Aug 2020, Nigel Reed said the following...

I'm not really following this line of thinking.

Not at all.

Meaning that general has access to every band that extra does. So any radio
or antenna you buy to cover band X will be accessible whether you are a
general or an extra.

Same mostly goes for antennas, though as a general you'd have a different center of band to tune the antenna.


- Andre`

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Nigel,

I may invest if I can find the time to indulge myself in 2 weeks of relentless bombardment of facts, figures, and forumlas that I will
never care about again, probably :)

Agreed. With a lot of that, it's like the joke of the little boy asking
"Why should I study about The American Revolution?? I know who won!!" <G>.

The only other thing is me balking at the cost of a decent radio setup.

The dealers must think we're filthy rich...but in reality, hams are
"frugal cheapskates". A few years back, on an episode of Amateur Radio Newsline, they were talking about a DC to Daylight rig, at Hamvention,
for $20,000!! Now, I could outfit a nice shack for that amount...but for
one rig, that's overkill.

The advantage operating "internet radio" (much to the angst of the
purists), is that I don't have to worry about the cost of rigs, power
supplies, SWR meters, antennas, coaxial cable, tuners, and of course,
all of the rig accessories. I did a demo at an area high school ham
radio club, and told them that considering the price of college
tuition nowadays, it's the like the cartoon of the robber trying to
hold up this man...the thug is told "You're wasting your time!! I'm
a ham!!" <G>. Then, you have the one where the ham says "My greatest
fear is that I'll die, and my wife will sell my radios for what I told
her that I paid for them!!" <BG>.

Daryl, WX4QZ

... H.A.M. Radio Operator: H)ave A)nother M)eal.
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Andre,

Why are you interested in extra?

There are only 5 real advantages to upgrading to Amateur Extra:

1) Full amateur radio privileges, although on HF, you still have to
stay 3 kc's away from the band edges, to avoid going "out of band".
There is 500 kilohertz of HF spectrum not available to General class licensees...and 250 kilohertz of HF spectrum not available to Advanced
Class licensees.

2) The shorter 2x1 or 1x2 callsigns...*IF* you're lucky enough to
get one.

3) If traveling overseas, you can get Extra Class privileges with
the CEPT license.

4) As a Volunteer Examiner, you can give and grade ALL the exams.

5) Snob appeal (hi hi).

But, if you have no desire for ANY of the above, there is more than
enough to say grace over, with just a General Class license...which is
the license that the majority of HF operators, hold.

I had to upgrade to Amateur Extra to become a VE Team leader, but
the last time I operated HF was on the Arkansas and Missouri Railroad
Memorial Day Troop Train in 2011 (details on my QRZ bio). Otherwise,
I operate exclusively in the Technician privileges (D-Star, D-Rats,
Packet, Echolink), as I enjoy them.

Daryl, WX4QZ

... What if someone's real name is a psuedonym??
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Hello Nigel!

13 Aug 20 03:09, you wrote to Daryl Stout:

HamTestOnline does offer a money back guarantee, if you fail the
exam. But, in using them, I went from Technician to General in 14
days, and from General to Amateur Extra 13 days later. To me, it was
the best money I ever spent in ham radio.

I may invest if I can find the time to indulge myself in 2 weeks of relentless bombardment of facts, figures, and forumlas that I will
never care about again, probably :)

I'm currently studying to take my Technician and General exam at the same time, using an app on my phone from Hamstudy.org The app was like $3 from the app store (I have an Android phone, I'm pretty sure it's also available on iOS). All it does is ask you the questions on the test. if you get it wrong, you can click "more info" which will give you information on what the correct answer is, and sometimes handy tips and tricks to remember that answer when it comes back up. It will tell you what your best/worst sections are, and will allow you to answer questions just from the sections you're weakest on.

It will chart your progress on practice tests, which I'm taking at least once a day. It will also tell you how much of the question pool you've seen/answered.


I have a friend who just took (and passed, first time) his extra exam using this app. he said once he had seen 100% of the question pool, his test scores shot up to around 90%, which is a comfortable range to pass the actual test.

The only other thing is me balking at the cost of a decent radio
setup.

Yeah, why are hobbies always so damn expensive?



Mike


... Listen. I'm tired of making this stuff up. Let's go look at some boobies! --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20180707

On 15 Aug 2020, Mike Miller said the following...

$3 from the app store (I have an Android phone, I'm pretty sure it's
also available on iOS). All it does is ask you the questions on the

It is available on iOS and iPad OS.

once a day. It will also tell you how much of the question pool you've seen/answered.

That reminds me. For extra, I only did one section at a time until I got up over 80% competency, then moved to the next section. Only after hitting 80%
in each section did I start using the complete pool.

I have a friend who just took (and passed, first time) his extra exam using this app. he said once he had seen 100% of the question pool, his test scores shot up to around 90%, which is a comfortable range to pass the actual test.

80% on practice exams is fine. It's feasible that you'll get a bad exam and fail, but that won't happen twice. I used the 80% mark on all three exams and passed all three of them on the first try. My son did the same and scored higher on all three exams than I did.

- Andre, WT9X

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Andre,

Meaning that general has access to every band that extra does. So any radio or antenna you buy to cover band X will be accessible whether you are a general or an extra.

There are only 500 kilohertz of spectrum that General Class hams can't
use, and 250 kilohertz of spectrum that Advanced Class hams can't use;
both in comparison to Amateur Extra. However, most hams that operate HF
have the General Class license.

Daryl, WX4QZ

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On 15 Aug 2020, Daryl Stout said the following...

There are only 500 kilohertz of spectrum that General Class hams can't use, and 250 kilohertz of spectrum that Advanced Class hams can't use; both in comparison to Amateur Extra. However, most hams that operate HF have the General Class license.

Yeah, I totally agree. I got it because during the NJQRP Skeeter Hunt contest last year (was also today, coincidentally), I kept hearing people just below where generals could go. So I figured between that, and having the shorter call, it was worth it for my occasional contest or for getting into pileups more easily.

But once I started studying the extra material, I realized that it was the first exam level material that was really interesting.

- Andre, WT9X

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Mike,

The only other thing is me balking at the cost of a decent radio
setup.

Yeah, why are hobbies always so damn expensive?

They're like spouses or significant others...we're married to them,
and all that goes with them. <G>

Do you, Sysop, take this BBS to be your lawfully wedded spouse??

OR

Do you, Ham, take Radio, to be your lawfully wedded spouse??

For "the rest of the story" on the latter, go to https://www.theweatherwonder.com/elk.htm -- and look for a file
called "The Triple Play". It is full of ham radio humor and puns.

Daryl, WX4QZ

... Why were the Indians here first? They had reservations.
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Re: Trying to study for extra
By: Mike Miller to Nigel Reed on Sat Aug 15 2020 12:00:27

I'm currently studying to take my Technician and General exam at the same time, using an app on my phone from Hamstudy.org The app was like $3 from the app store (I have an Android phone, I'm pretty sure it's also available on iOS). All it does is ask you the questions on the test. if you get it

I've using Ham Test Prep which is similar, I guess, except it doesn't give you more information, which sometimes help stuff stick, or explain it. I picked up a book somewhere which was pretty decent. It's used so I didn't pay full price. Books are easier for me to read then I can practice on the phone.
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