https://youtu.be/MtyFg2GsRCY
https://youtu.be/miksqeHTlsI
I need advice/assistance on determining the authenticity of the contents of
a collection of 3 1/2", 400k HFS formatted floppies I received.
<snip lots of interesting info>
Hello! That all looks super cool and, if you can get the disks imaged, I would love to host them on my site vintageapplemac.com and also get them running in the Internet Archive’s in-browser Macintosh emulator.
Really early Mac stuff like this isn’t my forte, my interest is from late 80s through to the Millennium, but I will share your post to my Twitter
now
(@vintageapplemac) as many of my followers are experts and will certainly have opinions, and likely answers too!
Hello! That all looks super cool and, if you can get the disks imaged, I
would love to host them on my site vintageapplemac.com and also get them
running in the Internet Archive’s in-browser Macintosh emulator.
Really early Mac stuff like this isn’t my forte, my interest is from late >> 80s through to the Millennium, but I will share your post to my Twitter
now
(@vintageapplemac) as many of my followers are experts and will certainly
have opinions, and likely answers too!
Thank you so much!! I've tried emailing a few youtubers, and posting on macgui.com (it won't let me make a new thread), as well as researching it (found none of the Applications), and you are the only one to respond affirmatively and offer help. I will check your website and Twitter, hopefully we can be in contact there.
I need to know the best way to image these disks so they are workable in emulators like Mini Vmac as well as bootable on a real 68k back but I am unsure how and thats the biggest issue. I use Windows for games now and
Linux the rest of the time, and have been emulating 68k Macs since with Vmac and Basilisk II since 2000 or so.
The floppyemu device I ordered will come with boot disks for every 68k Mac System, but I am unsure what OS I should run to make the .dsk files since
the majority of the disks with interesting content run either Finder 1.0 or Finder 1.1g and "Get Info" on the disks shows date stamps from early 1984.
Thank you!
Hello! That all looks super cool and, if you can get the disks imaged, I
would love to host them on my site vintageapplemac.com and also get them
running in the Internet Archive’s in-browser Macintosh emulator.
Really early Mac stuff like this isn’t my forte, my interest is from late >> 80s through to the Millennium, but I will share your post to my Twitter
now
(@vintageapplemac) as many of my followers are experts and will certainly
have opinions, and likely answers too!
Thank you so much!! I've tried emailing a few youtubers, and posting on macgui.com (it won't let me make a new thread), as well as researching it (found none of the Applications), and you are the only one to respond affirmatively and offer help. I will check your website and Twitter, hopefully we can be in contact there.
I need to know the best way to image these disks so they are workable in emulators like Mini Vmac as well as bootable on a real 68k back but I am unsure how and thats the biggest issue. I use Windows for games now and
Linux the rest of the time, and have been emulating 68k Macs since with Vmac and Basilisk II since 2000 or so.
You'll want to use Apple's DiskCopy 4.14.2
On 2019-07-09 11:07 a.m., Lain Iwakura wrote:
Hello! That all looks super cool and, if you can get the disks imaged, I >>> would love to host them on my site vintageapplemac.com and also get them >>> running in the Internet Archive’s in-browser Macintosh emulator.
Really early Mac stuff like this isn’t my forte, my interest is from
late
80s through to the Millennium, but I will share your post to my Twitter
now
(@vintageapplemac) as many of my followers are experts and will
certainly
have opinions, and likely answers too!
Thank you so much!! I've tried emailing a few youtubers, and posting on
macgui.com (it won't let me make a new thread), as well as researching it
(found none of the Applications), and you are the only one to respond
affirmatively and offer help. I will check your website and Twitter,
hopefully we can be in contact there.
I need to know the best way to image these disks so they are workable in
emulators like Mini Vmac as well as bootable on a real 68k back but I am
unsure how and thats the biggest issue. I use Windows for games now and
Linux the rest of the time, and have been emulating 68k Macs since with
Vmac
and Basilisk II since 2000 or so.
You'll want to use Apple's DiskCopy 4.1 to do the actual imaging. Since
the disks are 400K disks, the resulting images will be MFS images. In my experience, MFS images can be mounted in mini vMac or in SheepShaver
running System 7, but not running system 8 or later. If You want the
images to be mountable in System 8 or later you'll need to copy the
contents of the disk to an HFS image, but these will not be mountable on pre-System 3 systems.
André
1) Are you sure they are MFS formatted? The original Macintosh was before my time but I have read that MFS does not support nested folders, yet these disks have nested folders (I always thought this meant a folder inside a folder...) This may be important for imaging them.
2) The location I'm in is relatively hot and extremely rainy lately with
very high relative humidity. Is it safe to put a packet of dehydrated silica (probably from inside an empty beef jerky package)? Theoretically it should absorb moisture from the air in the hard plastic binder with all the important disks.
André G. Isaak wrote:
On 2019-07-09 11:07 a.m., Lain Iwakura wrote:
Hello! That all looks super cool and, if you can get the disks imaged, >>>> I
would love to host them on my site vintageapplemac.com and also get
them
running in the Internet Archive’s in-browser Macintosh emulator.
Really early Mac stuff like this isn’t my forte, my interest is from >>>> late
80s through to the Millennium, but I will share your post to my Twitter >>>> now
(@vintageapplemac) as many of my followers are experts and will
certainly
have opinions, and likely answers too!
Thank you so much!! I've tried emailing a few youtubers, and posting on
macgui.com (it won't let me make a new thread), as well as researching
it
(found none of the Applications), and you are the only one to respond
affirmatively and offer help. I will check your website and Twitter,
hopefully we can be in contact there.
I need to know the best way to image these disks so they are workable in >>> emulators like Mini Vmac as well as bootable on a real 68k back but I am >>> unsure how and thats the biggest issue. I use Windows for games now and
Linux the rest of the time, and have been emulating 68k Macs since with
Vmac
and Basilisk II since 2000 or so.
You'll want to use Apple's DiskCopy 4.1 to do the actual imaging. Since
the disks are 400K disks, the resulting images will be MFS images. In my
experience, MFS images can be mounted in mini vMac or in SheepShaver
running System 7, but not running system 8 or later. If You want the
images to be mountable in System 8 or later you'll need to copy the
contents of the disk to an HFS image, but these will not be mountable on
pre-System 3 systems.
André
Excellent! That is exactly what I needed to know, and of course, I
understand the difference between MFS and HFS.
I do not use Macs anymore and have no other classic Macs, I switched to
PCs
after 68k Macs and never looked back. I still use PCs and am very familiar with 68k Mac emulation.
I have two additional questions:
1) Are you sure they are MFS formatted? The original Macintosh was before
my
time but I have read that MFS does not support nested folders, yet these disks have nested folders (I always thought this meant a folder inside a folder...) This may be important for imaging them.
2) The location I'm in is relatively hot and extremely rainy lately with
very high relative humidity. Is it safe to put a packet of dehydrated
silica
(probably from inside an empty beef jerky package)? Theoretically it
should
absorb moisture from the air in the hard plastic binder with all the important disks.
I am running two dehumidifiers, one a large capacity $200 model that we
got
last year because of these conditions, and have filled the finished
basement
with about 5 small buckets of moisture absorbing charcoal (?) from a
hardware store, as well as one large one (The product is called "DampAid") but in a finished basement it is still around 76F with 47% relative
humidity. I watched a Japanese game preservation society documentary from
nhk on YouTube and they were keeping it below 60F and 35% relative humidity...
Also I have reached out to the first poster who owns vintageapplemacintosh.com over private email, I will not receive any sent
to
LainIwakura@macgui.com, I am only able to use their usenet reader as they
no
longer have a mail server. I was going to post the same initial post I
made
on their forums but it would not let me post there no matter what I did,
and
I was impatient as I have been trying to get help with this since last
Thurs.
I even tried the purported emails for Steve Capps and Andy Hertzfeld with
no
reply.
I would advise Stephen of vintagemac to check his websites email and
respond
as I want to remain anonymous and don't want to deal with too many people. Please understand. Thanks
You'll want to use Apple's DiskCopy 4.1 to do the actual imaging. Since
the disks are 400K disks, the resulting images will be MFS images.
Wikipedia writes in their article <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floppy_disk>:
The first Macintosh computers use single-sided 3 12-inch floppy disks,
but with 400 KB formatted capacity. These were followed in 1986 by double-sided 800 KB floppies.
The higher capacity was achieved at the
same recording density by varying the disk rotation speed with head
position so that the linear speed of the disk was closer to constant.
Therefore, 400K disks are not necessarily formatted in MFS
- since the
800K disks were introduced in 1986 and MFS dropped by Apple in 1985.
In article <1oagyp1.1e01kaodelw48N%christian180801@ghanart.org>,
Christian <christian180801@ghanart.org> wrote:
Wikipedia writes in their article
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floppy_disk>:
wikipedia is not always a good reference, and in this case, quite poor.
The first Macintosh computers use single-sided 3 12-inch floppy disks,
but with 400 KB formatted capacity. These were followed in 1986 by
double-sided 800 KB floppies.
1985
The higher capacity was achieved at the
same recording density by varying the disk rotation speed with head
position so that the linear speed of the disk was closer to constant.
nope. the higher capacity was because it was double-sided. 400 kb per
side.
both 400 & 800 kb floppies were variable speed, gaining capacity over
the standard 360 kb and 720 kb floppies on windows pcs.
1.4 mb floppies were constant speed and worked on both mac and windows
pcs. apple called the hd floppy drive a superdrive, later reusing the
name for their dvd drive.
Therefore, 400K disks are not necessarily formatted in MFS
nope. 400 kb floppies were mfs and 800 kb were hfs, although it was
possible to format them the opposite.
- since the
800K disks were introduced in 1986 and MFS dropped by Apple in 1985.
nope. mfs support remained for more than a decade, although read only
at the end.
Lain Iwakura wrote:
André G. Isaak wrote:
On 2019-07-09 11:07 a.m., Lain Iwakura wrote:
Hello! That all looks super cool and, if you can get the disks imaged, >>>>> I
would love to host them on my site vintageapplemac.com and also get
them
running in the Internet Archive’s in-browser Macintosh emulator.
Really early Mac stuff like this isn’t my forte, my interest is from >>>>> late
80s through to the Millennium, but I will share your post to my Twitter >>>>> now
(@vintageapplemac) as many of my followers are experts and will
certainly
have opinions, and likely answers too!
Thank you so much!! I've tried emailing a few youtubers, and posting on >>>> macgui.com (it won't let me make a new thread), as well as researching >>>> it
(found none of the Applications), and you are the only one to respond
affirmatively and offer help. I will check your website and Twitter,
hopefully we can be in contact there.
I need to know the best way to image these disks so they are workable in >>>> emulators like Mini Vmac as well as bootable on a real 68k back but I am >>>> unsure how and thats the biggest issue. I use Windows for games now and >>>> Linux the rest of the time, and have been emulating 68k Macs since with >>>> Vmac
and Basilisk II since 2000 or so.
You'll want to use Apple's DiskCopy 4.1 to do the actual imaging. Since >>> the disks are 400K disks, the resulting images will be MFS images. In my >>> experience, MFS images can be mounted in mini vMac or in SheepShaver
running System 7, but not running system 8 or later. If You want the
images to be mountable in System 8 or later you'll need to copy the
contents of the disk to an HFS image, but these will not be mountable on >>> pre-System 3 systems.
André
Excellent! That is exactly what I needed to know, and of course, I
understand the difference between MFS and HFS.
I do not use Macs anymore and have no other classic Macs, I switched to
PCs
after 68k Macs and never looked back. I still use PCs and am very familiar >> with 68k Mac emulation.
I have two additional questions:
1) Are you sure they are MFS formatted? The original Macintosh was before
my
time but I have read that MFS does not support nested folders, yet these
disks have nested folders (I always thought this meant a folder inside a
folder...) This may be important for imaging them.
2) The location I'm in is relatively hot and extremely rainy lately with
very high relative humidity. Is it safe to put a packet of dehydrated
silica
(probably from inside an empty beef jerky package)? Theoretically it
should
absorb moisture from the air in the hard plastic binder with all the
important disks.
I am running two dehumidifiers, one a large capacity $200 model that we
got
last year because of these conditions, and have filled the finished
basement
with about 5 small buckets of moisture absorbing charcoal (?) from a
hardware store, as well as one large one (The product is called "DampAid") >> but in a finished basement it is still around 76F with 47% relative
humidity. I watched a Japanese game preservation society documentary from
nhk on YouTube and they were keeping it below 60F and 35% relative
humidity...
Also I have reached out to the first poster who owns
vintageapplemacintosh.com over private email, I will not receive any sent
to
LainIwakura@macgui.com, I am only able to use their usenet reader as they
no
longer have a mail server. I was going to post the same initial post I
made
on their forums but it would not let me post there no matter what I did,
and
I was impatient as I have been trying to get help with this since last
Thurs.
I even tried the purported emails for Steve Capps and Andy Hertzfeld with
no
reply.
I would advise Stephen of vintagemac to check his websites email and
respond
as I want to remain anonymous and don't want to deal with too many people. >> Please understand. Thanks
Also see:
https://youtu.be/Hlu2skShICw
I made this for you guys. One of the disks has games and is in great shape, meaning it sounds better in the disk drive than all of the others, even
after thoroughly cleaning and lubricating the drive.
It has two seemingly dev versions of Mouse Stampede, the very first 3rd
party Macintosh game, according to some site. See the Youtube description.
It also contains Daleks which may also be an early dev version. I never
liked that game much, but I know some people are bonkers over it.
I won't be loading the disk again except to image it. Feel free to pass that video around Twitter etc etc.
Apologies for breaking nerd conventions by double posting on usenet, but no one has used this commonly for a long time so I don't much care. And tell
the vintageapplemac.com guy to answer my email. ;)
Also I have reached out to the first poster who owns vintageapplemacintosh.com over private email, I will not receive any sent
to
LainIwakura@macgui.com, I am only able to use their usenet reader as they
no
longer have a mail server. I was going to post the same initial post I
made
on their forums but it would not let me post there no matter what I did,
and
I was impatient as I have been trying to get help with this since last
Thurs.
Hi, I got your PM on Mac GUI. I replied to it. You can also email me dog_cow@macgui.com
snip useful information( ^◡^)っ✂
Hi, I got your PM on Mac GUI. I replied to it. You can also email me dog_cow@macgui.com
You probably saw that I write the Mac 512K Blog, and I am fully equipped
to
process and archive any type of Apple or Macintosh disk, and I can also
give
practical advice concerning the same.
Hi, I got your PM on Mac GUI. I replied to it. You can also email me
dog_cow@macgui.com
snip useful information( ^◡^)っ✂
Hi, I got your PM on Mac GUI. I replied to it. You can also email me
dog_cow@macgui.com
You probably saw that I write the Mac 512K Blog, and I am fully equipped
to
process and archive any type of Apple or Macintosh disk, and I can also
give
practical advice concerning the same.
Hmm. My modern rig/environment is probably not equipped to do this- no
serial port- but I *do* have a Raspberry Pi with NOOBS (I generally use
them
as kodi boxes, as well as for emulating arcade machines and 90s
consoles...)
But there may be some kind of serial port board I could attach, I can also solder so no problem that way. A Pi running NOOBS can probably handle it.
I've actually figured it out and have imaged some of the disks, the others may be too far degraded to save due to humidity damage, bit rot, RF interference, and other things I'm aware cause floppies this age to become ruined. Disk Copy 4.2 gives me error -71. I don't think its the drive, probably the disks. So you may not even be able to recover them..
Anyway, I contacted vintageapplemac with the details of the operation.
As far as sending them to you... or the implication...LOL
I'll have Christie's come out and evaluate them and price them before that
;)
Also- why can I not post on your forums? (Answer please!) Will I be able
to
on desktop?
Some ancient custom version of vBulletin, tsk tsk... I used to install it
and run it on some quite large pirate MMO servers. And the servers themselves. (WoW for example.) I saw some weird avatar system you probably coded that changes color based on years you are a member.
I really detest elitism. Even if I'm a 'kiddie,' (actually not I can do
LUA
and scripted my mmo servers but..)... I'd like to think I'm decent with hardware.
If thats why I can't post... You're really discouraging any kind of
community from forming or people from coming forward with stuff like this.
Also... Its the Reddit era now man ;)
I'm not sure whether Lain is actually looking for help or not.... Here's
the
reply I received from him via PM.
Can someone help me understand this reply, and what would cause him to act this way???
Lain Iwakura wrote:
Its ok.
I already got in touch with other people through usenet. Including
someone
who worked at Apple in 86. They have helped me.
I have already imaged some of the disks and will be sending the images to
the people who helped me.
Also, why can't I post on your forums? I tried to under the software
section, and it was my message I sent to you. Every time I tried to post,
it said "you must wait a while before posting again", and never posted to
the board after clicking submit. I am on mobile using Android.
So, I will just send the images I made to them and not upload them here!
Including the development version of Through the Looking Glass, two
development versions of "Mouse Stampede", the first 3rd party Macintosh
game, as well as the Macintalk development programs, early version and
any
code found.
I'll tell the people who helped me not to distribute the images. For now.
Thanks for your useless reply. Fix your ancient site! Razz
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